I feel the women still has the right to choose,but in my own opinion I will stick with what Dr.Lisa theory.Myself I would and did choose the hospital way.I guess I don't understand why a woman would want to have a home birth.Thats my 2 cents.

Well this one is a Great topic. I have 2 children and had both of them at a Hospital on;y for the fact of the Pain.  on the other hand I work for a Doctor's office in IL that does homebirths and I think it is wonderful thing that patients can choose what they want. The patients do all there care at the office through the whole pregnacy and the doctors will know if they are two high risk to deliver at home or not. But almost all of our ob patients do deliver at home very well. And comeback for the rest of there pregancy though out the years. We do tell our First time pateints the sould have a Doula to help the through this time when they go into labor for support.  If I was not such a wimp I would have done it.  My sister did it 11 years ago and I was there for the whole thing it was amazing and brave of her and two see all the nurses and Dr's there to help. But she got to be in her own home and very confontforable.  So I agree with both sides of the story. 

I hope no one truly believes this analogy. That's like saying we should not give anyone any kind of medical treatment for anything. "Nope, can't treat ya for your cancer. Nature has to take its course!" That's Bull!

I don't expect anyone to believe the analogy. But I hope that people will think more on the subject instead of just hating doctors and being fooled by brainwashing authors who want to sell books. Not having a doctor handy means you trust nature to see you through. Nature sucks. That's why we have worked so hard to improve on it. I thank you all for your intelligent comments. And I hope I've saved at least one life.

I think that the blogger is over looking the fact that homebirths are most often attended by skilled, experienced, and qualified midwives. On average, midwives know a lot more about the birthing process in the way that it was meant to happen than most doctors do, and taking what should be the average birth into a highly medicalized atmosphere is simply over kill. Birth is not a medical situation- it is something that happens naturally and that our bodies are made to do on their own. Simply put, if you leave a pregnant woman be, she will have a baby. She doesn't need a fetal moniter or an IV drip or an epidural in order to progress the order of man- she needs some peace, and some quiet, and some space to move around. She needs some body who understands all of this and who can be there for her without intervening with the process. 

Thanks for taking the time to blog. I agree Hospital why would anyone want to take a chance at harming their child if something went wrong and was so far from help???

Dornmama and any other paranoid doctor haters.... go blog elswhere. This discussion is only for people who at least see anothers point of view. Everyone knows doctors make mistakes. So do midwives. So do mothers. I see why mothers are afraid of hospitals. You only hear about the bad stuff. No one hears about the billion births that go well. Homebirths are the same. This is only about what can happen when somethng goes horrably wrong. Who wouldn't want a doctor handy? Riki Lake is selling a book. Riki Lake doesn't know everything.

"This discussion is only for people who at least see anothers point of view."

which is what was being expressed.

if ignorance is bliss, then this is one happy place.

althought i suppose that i shouldn't have expected intelligent, openminded conversation to spawn from a community that rallies around a sub-par day time television show. sorry that i tried to open a few minds. you can continue to medicate yourselves now. *shrug*

You go Pinkers,I am behind you all the way.....When people tell you what you can say from your own experiences,they are trying to get you to their way of thinking,It's time to stop and ignore and move on to people who want to discuss things like adults without snide comments.

if ignorance is bliss, then this is one happy place.

You seem as ignorant to the dangers...

althought i suppose that i shouldn't have expected intelligent, openminded conversation to spawn from a community that rallies around a sub-par day time television show

Why are you participation with the sub-par show?

"Riki Lake doesn't know everything."And neither do you!

I know. That's why I let experts do what they do best.

I see this is no place for an open minded discussion about birth options but instead a place for "Homebirth" bashing

You guys are just as close minded and stubborn. I've aggreed with some stuff you said. All I want is an agreement that things COULD go horribly wrong with a home birth. I've already said that most births will happen with no problem no matter where. Who's mind is closed?

After much thought I have deleted my postes. Not because I feel my stance on Homebirth is wrong but because the comments I made were made out of anger instead of being intilectual and fact based as they should have. I sincerely appologise for the rude and hurtful comments I made. I only hope that one day you will be able to look at those of us who choose to home birth with the same respect for our choices as you ask that we show to yours.

Do what is right for you. But don't place the blame on others when the outcome isn't what you expected. To all their own. Live life to the fullest. Education is being used to manipulate people so that product will sell. Just be aware that information is manipulated to suit the seller and not the buyer.

There's no guarantee of competence or outcome regardless of where you give birth.  The facts simply do not support hospital birth as safer than home for low-risk pregnancies.  Things can horribly wrong, period.  But they usually don't.  It should be up to women to be informed and make the best choice for themselves, the choice they can best live with.  Unfortunately, too many women assume that obs only have the patients best interest.  Some do, many want to but are limited in what they can provide--thru no fault of their own, it is simply the current system.

I know lots of the "what-ifs," and I feel I could better handle something bad happening during a natural course of events than I could if it was a result of things being done to me/baby.  And stats say that my chances are about equal in either place.  

Hemorrhage is one thing that is thrown out alot. First of all, midwives are equipped to deal with it the same as a hospital would initially.  Secondly, many hospital interventions lead to higher rates of hemorrhage.  Lastly, women have died because they have hemorrhaged after being d/c'd from a hospital birth--there is a lot more follow up and postpartum support in the midwifery model of care which means someone is paying attention to symptoms of problems, unlike a typical medical birth.

I know a few women who were pretty well informed going into their hospital birth, felt supported by their obs, asked the right questions, were given good answers....and it all went differently when labor started.  The support they were told they could expect was not there.  They got interventions they didn't want, and in retrospect are not even given a reason for needing.  Years later they are still bothered by it.  Mom's experience does matter, obviously a live baby and mother are most important but they are not the only important things.

pinkers--I just meant the initial intervention for hemorrhage, which I really do understand is a serious situation.  Midwives typically carry pitocin, which is what a hospital would start with.  Obviously it's easier for the hospital to get an already admitted patient to an OR, but is there other equipment that i'm not thinking of that would make a hospital better prepared? Some comments seem to practically say that a mw doesn't know what hemorrhage is or would just sit back and say "darn it." I wanted to point at that they are as equipped as a nurse is, and that a hospital birth is no guarantee that fatal hemorrhage won't occur.  Fortunately, these are both rare events.

That's one of the first questions that most women ask about when interviewing a midwife, how do you handle emergencies?  I want to know about transfers they've had, when they transfer, how the relationship is with the hospital, what-if any-ob they partner with.  I would never use a mw that gave an answer that gave her a reason to hesitate about getting medical help.

I do not think homebirth is for everyone, and would never push it on someone.  I just don't understand, in face of all the studies and stats, why our country doesn't make homebirth a viable option for all women.  Making it legal and affordable would also make it safer than it is now. 

And I'm glad you have that choice.  The point is, your decision is not based on any factual information that says you and your baby are safer in a hospital.  YOU feel safer, and therefore it is the best place for you.  With the info I have, *I* feel safer at home, therefore it is the best choice for me.  Too many women don't have the choice, they don't get to decide.  Most don't even get the information that would help them make the decision.

My ideal would be that we get the info and can have discussions and know the pros and cons of our options, not have some entity say that everyone should things 1 way.

In many states it is illegal for a midwife to attend a homebirth, it's not illegal to birth at home but no one can be hired to attend the birth (there have been families that were visited by child protective services, being turned in for not birthing in a hospital).  In other states it is alegal (not sure that's a real word, lol...but there's not law saying mws can't attend birth but there's no protection either).  In some states, mine included fortunately, it is legal.  There is licensure (although it's not required).  I opened the phone book and found 6 homebirth midwives in the yellow pages and got the names and numbers of about 6 more.  I set up interviews, met numerous people that had homebirths.  It's pretty normal around here.  Still a small minority, but normal.  But we still had to pay out of pocket.  A couple of insurances will cover licensed mws, but not the carrier I had thru work.  

So, while we do all technically have a choice, it's hard to compare "insurance will cover everything and no one will question you about where you give birth" vs. "pay it all yourself, it's illegal so hide your intentions, there could be jail time for a mw that helps you, be prepared for harrassment if you need medical help during labor, and listen to everyone tell you your choice is dangerous and stupid."  What kind of choice is that?  No one has to fight for a hospital birth, most women would have to fight for a homebirth--and who wants a fight like that when pregnant?  What I really meant is a "realistic choice." 

The 'entity' is groups like ACOG and AMA who say hospitals are hands down the safest place to give birth and push for legislation to make it the only legal place to birth, and they have a lot of money and power to get that done.  They are doing a lot more than just suggesting expectant women use their services.

yeah, as much I love all the points of view on message boards like this, it's also can get out of hand easily.  I'm glad I came across conversational, as I intended to.  It's nice to have a discussion that isn't all about being defensive.  pinkers, are you not in the US, is that what you mean by "out there?"

There are a couple of great books about the history of maternity care, my favorite is Pushed by Jennifer Block.  She's a journalist, so she's coming at the issue from the outside.  She does a great job of showing how things came to be, but I didn't find her blaming of any one thing.

There's also Birth: The Surprising History of How We Are Born by Tina Cassidy.  It's even more of a textbook almost.  Really just facts of how different maternity care practice have come and gone, and evolved.

And I thank you two for a great debate. I did start it off to fuel the fire I admit. And in the message boards it has gone way out of control. I'm glad that those using my blog are intelligent, responsible people. :)

I grew up in so cal, although moved before having kids (i'm in oregon now).  I thought things were a bit better there, but I guess it just depends where you are.  

Another board got me thinking about this....there's a lot of mention of that small chance of something going wrong, and why take that chance of something going wrong at home.  Same goes for vbac, that small chance of uterine rupture and much smaller chance of it being fatal.  But what about those small chances of horrible risk that come with drugs?  And surgery?  It's dismissed as safe because the bad stuff happens so rarely.  Most women aren't even told what the risks are, but say you want an homebirth and/or a vbac and you will get an earful about the risks!

Does anyone else see some hypocrisy?  Not intentional, of course, but it doesn't really make sense.  "stats don't matter when you are in the .5%" can go both ways.  But it doesn't.  It's just so strange, and sad, to me that if something bad happens in the natural course of things then it is someone's fault for not intervening enough.  But if there is lots of intervention "just in case" which leads to something bad then it's seen as simply unavoidable and everyone did everything they could.  If you really look at the big picture, not just the people you know, it's all rather strange.

No, just the vast majority (at least 80%).  Why is the minority being browbeaten with "what-ifs" when the majority isn't even told about risks of interventions they are very likely to get?